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Question: Non-Pedal vs. Pedal for Hawaiian Music

Prefer Non-Pedal Steel
Both is Okay
Prefer Pedal Steel


« Created by: vangary on: 08/17/06 at 1:11pm »

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non-pedal vs pedal (Read 7533 times)
vangary
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non-pedal vs pedal
08/13/06 at 2:29am
 
I would think that is doesn't matter if it's a non-pedal guitar or a pedal steel as long as the topic is about Hawaiian steel guitar playing.  No "pedal steel" vs "non-peddlers' situation here, since I'm reasonably certain many of us Hawaiian steel guitar lovers play both.  
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Andy Sandoval
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #1 - 08/13/06 at 2:59am
 
Vangary, I agree. I've heard some really cool soundin Hawaiian played on both pedal and non pedal. I play mostly non pedal Hawaiian but am tryin to learn some of my songs on pedal steel too.
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Rick Alexander
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #2 - 08/13/06 at 2:12pm
 
I had a Sho-Bud Professional D-10, and I traded it for a 56 Stringmaster T-8.
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Danny James
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #3 - 08/14/06 at 10:49am
 
 I hope I am correct in believeing there is room for both non pedal & pedal steel guitar, if the subject is concerning hawaiian mucic.
 
   I started out at Harlin Bros. "Hawaiian " guitar studio at the age of 10 in 1948 on an acoustic student model non pedal Hawaiian guitar.  
 
 Shortly thereafter I switched to a non pedal electric steel guitar, then went to a "Multi-Kord" pedal "Hawaiian" steel guitar.
 
   The Multi-Kord was invented by Jay Harlin of the Harlin Bros. in Indianapolis, and was the first pedal steel guitar to be patented.  They were advertised and demonstrated as a "Hawaiian"steel guitar.
 
   I hope that the country steelers realize that the Multi-Kord and the Electra Harp designed by Alvino Rey is where the pedal steel got it's start.  The Steel guitar itself for the most part is originally Hawaiian.  I know that historically there may be some controversy there.
 
    I still play a 6 pedal Multi-Kord and also a non pedal Hawaiian guitar that I designed and built.
 
   I am so glad this Forum got started again and am sincerely hopeful that many young people will take an interest in Hawaiian music. We as individuals need to do all we can to generate that interest.
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Erv Niehaus
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #4 - 08/14/06 at 3:52pm
 
I play both pedal and non-pedal guitar. I am primarily a gospel player but there are a lot of gospel songs that have Hawaiian roots.  
 
I feel that you can get a lot more "expression" into the music when playing a non-pedal guitar what with the use of slants and so on.  
 
Sometimes a person's playing can get sort of bland when playing pedal steel. The primary reason I went to pedal steel was the ability to play "chordal" melody. I really like to play full three string grips.
Erv
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vangary
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #5 - 08/14/06 at 10:03pm
 
From reading the HSGA newsletters and seeing non-pedal guitars alongside pedal steels, it appears that many Hawaiian music enthusiasts like both as long as they are played well.    
I find it a real challenge to workout a non-pedal tune on the pedal guitar.  Helps my overall understanding of the instruments.  One of my favorite Hawaiian inspired breaks in a modern song, and I bet played on a pedal steel, is Paul Franklin's solo on Margaritaville recorded by Alan Jackson.  
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Erv Niehaus
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #6 - 08/15/06 at 9:52am
 
I have the opposite problem. It is much easier to find chord positions on a pedal steel than a non-pedal steel.  
Sometimes I like to take a pedal arrangement and try to play it on a lap guitar.  
That is quite a challange! In my opinion, you have to be a much more accomplished player to make a song sound good on a non-pedal guitar than a pedal model.
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vangary
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #7 - 08/16/06 at 12:04am
 
I agree with you Erv, working out something from pedal to non-pedal is more of a challenge.  I saw Jerry Byrd do it on an old "Opry" show tape, but I am no Jerry Byrd.  I can't even begin to think of where to start on something like Buddy's "Rose Colored Glasses" in C6th or E13th.  But, putting a classic non-pedal tune like "Moon of Manakoora" on pedal steel is much more fun and I find that people like to hear the lush chording.
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Mat Rhodes
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #8 - 08/16/06 at 1:11pm
 
I find that I can't serve two masters.  I can get fuller, more extended voicings and chord slurs with PS, but NPS, for me, requires a whole other skill set, mind set, and "compartmentalization", if you will.  If I spend too much time on one, I do it at the expense of the other.
 
But I will say that the brighter "signature tone" of NPS is harder to get on a PS.
 
Mat
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Jon Kostal
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #9 - 08/16/06 at 8:51pm
 
I've played pedal steel for over 25 years. When I first started, people told me to try lap steel, it would be a good learning experience. I wanted nothing to do with that. I wanted to mash on those pedals! And I did. Those things break alot of strings because of that.
 
So now I am playing lap, and a Stringmaster with 4 legs, and I find it to be very rewarding. It's definitely more difficult to find voicings on the non pedal guitar. It also is a benefit to the mastering of both instruments, if this is possible.
 
I haven't set up my Emmons P-P U12 in months.
 
I find the tone of the 2 guitars like night and day. The PS has so much metal hardware, the non pedal is basically just wood.
 
I love them both, but for me the non pedal guitar is the one for Hawaiian.
 
Aloha,
 
Jon
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basilh
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #10 - 08/17/06 at 11:13am
 
Hawaiian Style Pedal Steel Guitar..
 
 Dahill Sigh Oh  
 
 Princess Poo-Poo-ly  
 
 
 Flowers of Paradise
 
Noticeable usage of pedals :-
The intro of Da Hill and also 2:37
The solo in Princess Poo-Poo-Ly at 1:24 to 1:47 AND the last chord at 2:25
The Intro of Flowers of Paradise and the chord changes throughout the fills behind the vocal.
 
This would (In my opinion) be the definitive example of the Hawaiian Side of the Pedal Guitar, disguised pedal usage, as was the way then.
Basil
BTW In posting these EXAMPLES I am presuming that the readers of the topic honour the fact that they're for EDUCATIONAL purposes only and NOT for distribution etc.
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Mike Neer
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #11 - 08/17/06 at 12:35pm
 
Wouldn't that be "Dahil Sa'yo"?  I happen to sing this one, being married to a Filipina and all. Smiley
 
Incidentally, I've backed up Imelda Marcos on this tune not once, but twice!  Yikes.
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basilh
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #12 - 08/17/06 at 1:09pm
 
I'm SURE that you're right Mike, I just used the spelling that was on the record label and credits.
Two variations to choose from, neither of which is correct.
 
MCAD 31141 Best of Alfred Apaka Volume 1 on MCA Records lists it as "The song of Love" (Da Hill Sigh Oh)
and MCAD31139 Alfred Apaka  My Isle of Golden Dreams, lists it as "This Song of Love" (Dahil sa Lyo)
 
Baz
 Wink
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Patrick Ickes
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #13 - 08/20/06 at 10:54pm
 
I voted for non-pedal, but if the pedal mashing is done discretely, it works great.
I have a '37 Ric B-7, '55 Fender T-8 Stringmaster, and a '59 Fender 400 Pedal Guitar.  They all have that awesome " Shocked" tone.  The "modern" guitars like sho-bud, emmons, msa, etc are too sterile.  Maybe the poll should be changed to "non-knee lever guitars"? Wink
Patrick
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vangary
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Re: non-pedal vs pedal
Reply #14 - 08/21/06 at 1:20am
 
I think if I could post an educational recording of Sneaky Pete Kleinow's "Sleepy Lagoon" it might get another vote for Pedal Steel on the survey, or at least for "both".  Been thinking about him recently with his current illness and all.  He lets you hear the pedals unashamed, and his genius shines through.   Cool
 
Patrick, I recently purchased a 1937 B-7 and would love to see a pix of yours.  It is a really great sounding and playing axe and has really changed the way I think of and hear non pedal steel.
 
What serial # is yours?  Mine is #1312.
 

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